I said to a friend of mine "Hey, great! Redd Kross have got a new album coming out!". She said "The girl band?"

The brothers McDonald have been through some shit since they released their first single (on Posh Boy) back in '79 and their hilarious first album ("Born Innocent') on Frontier In '82. They've been from pillar to post over the past eighteen years, gone through labels like a hot knife, met a few heroes and are still - amazingly - only in their late 20's.

'Missing in Action' on these shores since late 1994, this spring saw the release of their latest magnum opus - "Show World' on This Way Up/Mercury - and the subsequent return of one of the worlds' most entertaining live shows to dear old London town. During their stay, I managed to grab Steven and Jeffrey for a yakk at their label's offices, in between their hunts for Beatle and Jack The Ripper landmarks. Some of what follows is strictly hush hush, off the record and on the QT.. know what I mean?

- How come you've been away for so long? It's almost been two years..

Jeffrey - Oh, well we worked the whole time. We toured for a year before we did "Phaseshifter" and for the two years after - surrounded by it constantly - and when we finished that tour, it was time to take a break. My wife and I were having a baby so I just wanted to relax and take care of the baby for a while (laughs) before I even picked up a guitar So it was about six months before we started writing and after that we started recording. We really didn't take that much of a break.

Steven - We worked on the album on and off for about a year but we didn't want the hassle of trying to work up a live set while we were recording.

- Then, Jeffrey, you got a viral illness - right?

J - Yeah, I got glandular fever right before we were supposed to turn the record in for the deadline. We were supposed to come here to play Donnington the same night as Kiss...

S - Waaugh! The Kiss reunion was excellent. I saw it at the L.A. Forum, where I saw Kiss for the first time, in 76' or something - when I was a little kid. I mean, it was good that we didn't have the best of seats though. It was like watching Sam Fox through a 'Vaseline' lens!

J - The Kiss concert really works, their whole show really lends itself to that reunion vibe - like a revival of "Carousel" or "The Sound Of Music".

S - It was better 'cause they didn't update it with a disco backbeat - like they would "Jesus Christ Superstar" or something. Those performances were so well documented when they started that they just went back...

J - And studied them.

- Have you ever met Gone Simmons & Co.?

J - Gene we know, slightly.

S - Gene actually performed with us at The Palace in Los Angeles a couple of years ago

J - If I went to a Kiss concert, Gene would probably recognise me....

S - And he'd grind his crotch in your face.

J - He'd grind his crotch in anybody's face!

But does he do it with style?

S - He does it with a shit-eating grin. A friend of mine, she was standing behind Kiss at that concert and said that you could see Gene's ass...

J - Like peek-a-boo butt cheeks!

- Eugh!

S - She said that she liked Gene Simmons so much that - if she had to - she'd wet-lick(?) his ass, I said, "How much do you like Gene?" she said "Put it this way, I would lick his ass".

J - Anyway, back to the question. Well, I just kept thinking "I'll be better", "If I'm not better in two days then we'll have to cancel" and it just went on and on. I didn't know what I had.

S - Jeff got sick in July and, like, Donnington is in August or something.

J - No! I got sick, like, two weeks before we were due to leave to do that show, I was sick in bed for a month. Luckily, it pushed everything back and gave us more time to prepare and get it together. It was so busy, we produce our own records - we're more involved - so the two months, month and a half that it took to record and mix was non-stop. In the last couple of weeks you're always trying to make up for time that you spent playing pinball. The days get very long, Y'know, it was, like, get ft together, rehearse for a few weeks and go out on tour again. Thank god I got ill! Another thing is that Dennis Wilson recorded "Pacific Ocean Blue" there at Village (recording studio).

S - It's kinda historical in Los Angeles...

J - For easy listening

S - It's the studio that they renovated for Fleetwood Mac to do "Tusk' and there's a vocal booth there that's known as the'Stevie Nicks vocal booth'. There's no real windows but there's a faux window in the vocal booth with a fake California/Malibu sunset!

J - Lots of wood panelling...

S - We were in a smaller studio there - doing the mixing - and our lounge had 'Star Wars' windows. Like, the faux windows of this lounge were 'outer space'! The walls were all mirrored - it was a very small room and they did this infinity thing - and the ceiling was all, like, little lights or 'stars'!

J - But the brilliant thing about this studio was when we were there one night at about three in the morning and Stephen says, like, "Doesn't Don Henley have an afro?" I was like, "Well, he did in The Eagles". We were playing pinball, walked down the hall and there was Don Henley (affects deep voice) "Oh, hi." (Laughs)

S - We should have asked - for the record did he have a perm in the 70's or does he 'relax' his hair in the 90's?

J - Yeah, it's a total 70's studio! I walked outside and Eddie (Kurdziel, 'Kross guitarist) was having this discussion with Jeff 'Skunk' Baxter from Steely Dan about guitar tones!

I noticed Eddie's 'Foghat" sticker on his guitar the other night.. tongue in cheek?

S - Oooh, that's hard to say but - kinda, like, y'know - the thing that rectifies the situation, for the few people that know about it, is that the letters on his "Foghat" sticker were cut up from one for "That Dog", an L.A. band.

J - Eddie almost got into a fight with another journalist because he said that Blue Oyster Cult were the "worst band ever". Eddie worships Foghat and Blue Oyster Cult and I saw him spinning outta control!

S - It was with a kinda 'snobby' magazine and kinda funny - old 'Foghat' Eddie.

J - Yeah, that early 70's thing; Eddie's from the 'Midwest' - where Ted Nugent is king - so he understands that it's funny but he's still very loyal to it.

In all Eddie's guitar solos you can tell where he's coming from - sometimes somewhere completely different to the rest of the song - but it still sounds cool.

J - Yeah, that's why we work with him 'cause I always liked that huge, 'arena rock' sound in kind of pop context but we do have to deal with his Blue Oyster Cult videos in the van when we're on tour!

- You produced "Show World" yourselves?

S - Yeah, we did the last one ("Phaseshifter") too - we took production credit although John Angello recorded it - with this record we've given Chris Shaw co-production.

J - We're 'control freaks' about the arrangements and the performances. It's really hard to articulate abstract ideas, if you don't have musical training there's no way to use the terminology. It'd be like speaking Latin to each other so a lot of times the easiest way to get an idea across is to eliminate the middle man - which is the producer. We find that working with a producer we have to fight and justify ideas and ft takes longer than actually just trying it. It turns out great this way because we just have a basic track, play with it for a day - dropping in vocals, instrumentation and arrangements - and end up with a 'piece' at the end of the day. If you had to run it through a producer - unless he really knew what he was doing and took charge - it would take forever.

- What about 'Third Eye "? That had a very different sound to anything else you've done - very poppy production...

S - The weirdest thing was listening to the four-track cassette demos for "Third Eye" - actually not a popular format at that time, around '89 - on the plane over. They were produced by our former guitar player Robert Hecker, who has the weirdest production sense, that was a weird trip.

J - There's a song on there called 'Teen God In An Oily Cocoon' which we totally forgot even existed and it was sooo great. Both Stephen and I - for the first three days - had this song stuck in our heads

So are you gonna do it?

S - We should. That song was actually co-written with the same guy who did 'Annie's Gone'...

J - And is now the 'millionaire' in the band Combustible Edison - I don't want to divulge his real name! (Laughs)

- Jeffrey, do you still write wfth your wife (Charlotte Caffrey, ex-Go-Go's)?

J - Yeah, Charlotte co-wrote 'Get Out Of Myself', our current single, We do collaborate, sometimes with other people...

S - Didn't some Brtish band have a single last year with 'Rush Hour' (tune by Jane Wiedlin, also ex-Go-Go's) on it? We covered that track a year after ft came out! Was it a big hit over here?

- Nah, the whole Go-Go's thing didn't really make much of a dent, as far as I can remember. Even the anthology that came out in '95 - with the newer tracks like 'The Whole World Lost lt's Head', which I think is fuckin' I brilliant - didn't really do much.

J - Charlotte told me that she can't even listen to that song because she had morning sickness sooo bad. She was pregnant with our daughter Astrid when she wrote it. Even to this day, to hear any of those songs makes her nauseous! (Laughs)

- (Sarcastically) Have you ever written with any of the famous LA. 'song doctors' - like Diane Warren?

J - (Laughs) Y'know, she's the only one of those people to have completed a move from the 80's to the 90's! She's, like, the most successful pop song writer of all time...

S-(Disgusted) Really?

J - Yeah, she's had more number ones than anyone...

S - Didn't she write 'Strawberry Fayre'?

J - No, she wrote 'Strawberry Fields'! (Laughs)

S - I'm sure she wrote 'Strawberry Fayre' for Anthony Newley back in the 60's...

J Are there any British equivalents to her?

- Well, there were some back in the 70's but we don't have anyone like Jim Steinman!

J - He writes stuff for Celine Dion too - her new record is like Goth, schlock, pop. I do know that she brought Phil Spector out of retirement. They went into Ocean Way Recorders last year because she had done 'River Deep Mountain High' on David Letterman (US talk show) and wanted to record it. She was like, "O.K., I'll work with Phil Spector

S - And she didn't know anything! (Laughs)

J - A D.J. friend of ours in L.A. - Rodney Bingenheimer - was at the sessions and at one point Phil went berserk and locked everyone - including Celine Dion - in the studio. Of course, he has guns in L.A. and he locked them in all night long, The only way they got out was that Celina Dion threw up - she was ill and she started throwing up - and he let them out after being held hostage for six hours! The weird thing is that I'm claustrophobic - I can't stand being locked in anyplace - and Rodney said "I've put you on the list to come to the Phil Spector session"! I remember telling Charlotte "I won't go 'cause he locks people in the studio" and she said "You're crazy, you have to go @ you get the chance!" It was, like, a few days later and Spector pulled this trick and, of course, he took the tapes and, like, no-one will ever hear them.

S - Wouldn't that have been great, to have been locked in the studio with Phil Spector?

J - No, no it wouldn't - I would've beat the shit out of him!

S - At least no-one pulled the trigger..

J - No! (Laughs) Cher told us an incredible thing about Phil Spector

S - You can't just come out with a statement like that'

J - We're from Hollywood! Everybody knows that we know! Cher was on all the Phil Spector records, she's on all The Ronettes records and she said - talking about Phil being crazy - she said "That's what happens when your parents are first cousins"! (Mucho laffs all round) Yeah, really - it's not in any of the books or anything.

- It's an exclusive!

J & S - Yeah!

S - It it's not in the September issue of "Raygun" magazine! (West Coast music rag with kool graphics)

J - I don't know, I didn't see it.

- That's a strange one, "Raygun". Sometimes it's a little difficult to read - 'cause of the layout - but it does some pretty good interviews.

J - It's not so bad anymore - just the first few issues...

S - When they put text on top of text.

J - The editor asked us to do interviews and our first one was with Debbie Gibson! (Laughs)

S - We said "O.K., we're game. Just as long as you can read the damn thing!' We were the first people where you could read what was written!

J - They don't edit your pieces or anything!

S - We send tapes, we don't even have to transcribe it!

J - They never fuck with it - ft's word for word...

S - I mean, they don't pay

J - Like, occasionally, I'll get a cheque for $100 over an interview I did a year before! But whoever you want to interview, they'll set it up.

- Who would you like to Interview.

J - I don't know...

S - I wanted to intermew Jonathan Richman but that never happened. I was told by his publicist that he doesn't do interviews. We want to interview John Waters.

J - "Pink Flamingos" and 'Female Trouble" are definitely his best films for me. I like his Mainstream' pehod too - those films are more subtle.

S - It'd be great to see 'Female Trouble" and "Citizen Kane" on a double feature!

What do you think "Spirit Of '76" (great schlock movie featuring Devo, Leif Garrett, David Cassidy and Jeffrey & Steve) would go well with on a double bill?

S - Oh my god!

J - "Rock & Roll High School" maybe...

Are you guys doing any more acting?

S - Yeah, I don't know if you guys know about Allison Ander's movie "Grace Of My Heart.

J - It's about a 'Tin Pan Alley' songwriter - like Carole King - set in the 60's. We have cameos in it...

- As what?

J 'The Beach Boys'!

S - I play sorta 'Al Jardine' and Jeff's definitely 'Mike Love' - to Matt Dillon's 'Brian Wilson'. We trash him so bad that he kills himself! He's playing his "Pet Sounds" for us and the song's about a pickle!

J - We got to improvise our whole scene with Ileana Douglas (who plays the lead in the movie), which was really cool. She's really cool.

S - Martin Scorcese produced the movie.

- Did you get to meet him?

S - No but Allison told me that he commented on 'our scene'. He was really into my ad-lib...

You're just big movie fans ain'tcha?

J - Yeah, we're big fans

S - We're from Southern California, we have no choice!

Are uou doing any videos to go with "Show World"?

S Well, we did one for 'Get Out Of Myself' - which hasn't been shown yet - and we're doing the video for "Mess Around" this week. London is an exotic location for us.

J - We want the video for 'Mess Around' to look exactly like a Sam Fox (tacky U.K. topless model/pop starlet from the 80's) video. That's what we're going for, what we achieve will be anybody's guess. The Sam Fox look.

- They definitely won It get that in the U.S.

J - Yeah, it'll be a revolutionary thing. We love the one where she's dancing with all these guys, wearing 'stone washed' jeans, in front of a brick wall!

- (Laughs) I ran't or won't remember that! You guys did a Version of the theme tune to 'The Double Deckers" (polyester-saturated U.K. 70's TV series for kids), how did you find out about that?

J - Well, they actually showed that when I was a little kid and a friend of mine accidentally ran across some 16mm prints...

S - (Starts to warble the tune in a high register) We knew those things before we even came to England! We like to do a little brushing up y'know. We tapped into the collective unconscious of the British people by referencing "The Double Deckers"!

- People under twenty five won't have a clue what the fuck you're on about!

J - Yeah, I know, I barely remembered that show. I do it all the time, when we're in France I always reference "The Martin Circus" who're this really dodgy pop group from the 70's. I only know about them 'cause I found a really fine looking picture of them on the street when I was there!

S - They're always talking about Serge (Gainsbourg) when we're over there.

At this point Stephen, who s been flicking through the "Guinness Book Of Hit Singles' throughout the interview, decides to grill me on the reasons why The Monkee's 'Alternate Title" was ..such a big hit over here", where it's original title ("Randy Scouse Git') came from - "Cool! Wow!", if their comeback is - in my opinion - a 'good thing' and whether "Head" is a "respected" movie in this country..

S - The Monkees never really went away..

J - But they are doing a tour with Mike (Nesmith).

S - They interviewed them on British television and Mike was just standing back, it was as if someone had him standing at gunpoint, like he didn't wanna be there.

- Maybe it was Phil Spector!

J - Or maybe he just inhaled next to Peter Tork! When "Head" first went into 'revival' in cinemas in the America they had a premiere for it and we were sitting right next to Mickey Dolenz - which was amazing! (Reflectively) Yeah, you guys show great movies over here - "Muscle Beach Party" was on the other night...

S - I love British television

J - You guys have three channels and there's always something on.

At that point Steven left to do a phone interview and Jeffrey and I chatted amiably about his unreleased solo album ("My Todd Rundgren album" as he called it) that was recorded in his basement, his current obsession with Laura Nyro records and the problem of finding really "startling" clothes to wear.

I then mentioned my friend's reference to Redd Kross as "The girl band" (due, no doubt, to the cover of their 1990 L.P "Third Eye" which showed hlm & Steven in extremely androgynous 70's gear and make-up);

J - It was kind of like Sonny & Cher.

- Which one of you was supposed to be Sonny?

J - Oh, we were both trying to be Cher..

Cue the music... ladies and gentlemen; Redd Kross!

Thanks to Steven & Jeffrey and Thls Way Up's Dave, Mike & Sophie (Good luck at V2!).

By: Joss Hutton